yikes

April 12th, 2007 | Site Update

Talk about flinging a rodent into the cat show. (Thank you for that image, ladiesbane.) I’m very, very sorry to have upset anyone with my misguided attempt to corral the conversation. Let’s just consider the Open Thread a failed experiment, shall we? So far all I seem to have accomplished is to double the number of comments. I just made my way through the 63 on “clustr,” and can’t yet bring myself to look at the 84 on the Open Thread. I’m going to go out for a ski to brace myself. Later, I will compose a formal response.

55 Responses to “yikes”

  1. Pam I says:

    Not misguided. More miscalculated. You couldn’t have known what the blog means to the regulars. Now you do. It’s just a little scary.
    Don’t forget your phone when skiing.

  2. silvio soprani says:

    Alison, I am relieved that you see us as the “cats,” not the “rats.”

  3. Jana C.H. says:

    Now I don’t have to feel guilty any more about posting the announcement that kicked the whole thing off. 😉

    Jana C.H.
    Seattle
    Saith Floss Forbes: If you don’t know the tune, sing tenor.

  4. Leda says:

    Hello,

    This only about the second time I’ve posted but I have loved this blog for some time now, for the contributions of both Alison and everyone else, I feel a bit like a spy sometimes…. So here is my penny’s worth on the current furore.

    The conversations that follow the posts are great, they are diverse, funny, intelligent and occasionally nutritious, they really add something to the blog. However I do think that perhaps the comments section is not the right place for them, for many reasons, not least that the flow of conversation could actually be helped (for posters and readers alike) by a message board format. Considering the friendly and benevolent tone of the comments usually, I have been surprised at the vehemence of the reaction to what I personally thought was a genuine attempt to re-think things for the better (for everyone, perhaps an impossible aim) and at that, an open and consultative one. Any change is going to feel odd initially but if the same lively, funny and imaginative posters continue to post, a change in format or protocol won’t be enough to kill the magic surely?

    This blog means a lot to me, as a regular reader and very very occasional poster but I can see that no matter how much it means to me, its not mine. I think Alison is incredibly generous with this lovely little space she has created (or allowed to grow) and the nature of the contributions of others is one of the things that really makes this blog special but it does seem completely reasonable to have, from time to time, a conversation about the space being shared and try new ways of doing that – doesn’t it?

  5. little gator says:

    We still like you regardless. At least, I do, and I doubt I’m the only one. Note how weaseliciously I seem to speak for others without actually doing so.

    And let’s all remember and I’m not just talking about those who may have been mad at Alison:

    You can be angry with someone and still like/love/be friends with them.

    Alison has referred to my topics! She’s read my posts! Tralalalala!

    Sorry. I’m just recovering from a painful but necessary argument with Mr Gator. Whom I still like and love and that’s the only reason I didn’t kill him, and vice versa.

  6. Tera says:

    I have been reading this blog on a regular basis for a very long time- however I rarely comment because the blog responses are so long, overwhelming and often so off the original topic that it seems useless to respond to the original blog : ( I think having a message board for off topic convos is a good idea

  7. meg says:

    Ok, so that’s why we got snow. Now I know.

    I still don’t like it, mind you.

  8. Aunt Soozie says:

    Why did you get snow, Meg? So Alison could ski on it?
    Telephone on the inside pocket so it stays warm and charged right?

    Tera,
    It’s never useless. If you feel inclined to comment I hope you will…and I don’t mean just here on Alison’s blog. You don’t have to read every word of every post before you do. you don’t have to refer to everything that’s already been said.

    As a frequent poster here I’d like it if you’d respond to what moves you…even if it was many words/thoughts ago.

    I’m delighted to read and see what Alison is up to and to read dtwof while the ink is still drying. (not just in Lesbian Connection) I’m curious about the other people who enjoy her work, what they think and feel…about her work and about the issues it evokes…whatever they may be.

    I’d like to encourage other people to join in and add to the discussion. I’m inclined to hold back and post less. Do you think that would help the shy or overwhelmed people? Is it about verbose people like me monopolizing the comments or is it about the diversity of the topics that evolve here? The organic flow is something that I and many others have said they enjoy. I believe I’d miss that element if there were various threads.

    I like that we are all here together…when you split a site into threads you do get “cliques” and people tend to stay in one place or the other. Various threads become little “in the know” chat rooms. Is that what is happening here? If so, I’m going to be more aware of what I write…I don’t want to contribute to a closed or exclusive feeling. That’s yucky.

  9. Tera says:

    Aunt Soozie
    thank you for the encouragement.

    when I see the same people posting back and forth it does feel clique like and I feel like I will just be interrupting. Thanks for having so much willingness to look at the ways this type of dialog can become closed and exclusive- even when everyone has the best of intentions!!! I’m going to try and comment when I feel like it and not be so intimidated

  10. Deena in OR says:

    Tera,

    I hope you do.

    And now for something completely off topic-

    I have one thing to say (with apologies to the non-idiot-box watchers out there)

    NBC Peacock bikini top! That may have been the funniest non verbal bit I’ve seen this season.

  11. AmandaTheGreat says:

    I gotta say, I don’t generally read the comments here because they’re so meandering and irrelevant to the post. I read comments on a blog post so I can see what other people thought of the post.

    But I’m one lurker in the myriad. My opinion counts for little.

  12. Pamela R says:

    Aunt Soozie, the problem is that there already IS a clique here. Yesterday’s posts made that clear. But hey, if Alison wants to continue as it was, that’s her prerogative. I’ll just stop reading the blog again and stick with the strips. It’s not like anything’s going to turn me off to THAT. 😛

  13. Vanlibris says:

    Gracious, folks. Breathe. Eat some chocolate. Find a support group – the les/bi/trans community is stuffed with ’em. DTOWOF is just a comic strip. Albeit a wonderful, witty, literate one that I’ve been reading on and off since the 80s.

    When you like the artist’s work, it’s really, really tempting to think of the artist as someone you “know” and have a relationship with, someone who therefore has an obligation of some sort to you. But you don’t know them, they aren’t your family or friend or lover or even your pet parakeet. They don’t owe you anything. They don’t know you.

    Fans can feel odd to deal with. Here is someone who admires you, so they think they know you. But after all, they’re not admiring you, the artist and person, but _an idea of you_. Which is generally 2 parts true, 3 parts not true, 6 parts undecided.

    Until I start paying for the website, Allison B. owes me or you nothing. As far as I’m concerned, she can organize the site any way she wants – she’s paying for it. (And these puppies do cost some hard bucks to maintain.) Like Pam R, I’ll be reading the strips no matter.

  14. Jana C.H. says:

    I don’t see that there are any cliques here because no one is keeping anyone out. Some of us post a lot more than others, but that’s not stopping anyone else from putting in her oar whenever she likes. Lurkerhood is entirely voluntary. I’ve never seen anyone on this blog (except the occasional troll) be stuck-up or obnoxious. Mouthy, yes. Obnoxious, no.

    If you feel intimidated by our so-called literary brilliance, we can’t do much about that. AB is a high-brow artist who attracts fans who like to play at being high-brow, but no one seems to take her intellectual pretensions too seriously. Just proofread your notes before you post them and plunge ahead. We don’t bite (though we might nibble a little).

    And I must say it is a pleasure to be blogging with people who can express themselves fully and never use a four-letter word.

    What, never? Well, hardly ever.

    Jana C.H.
    Seattle
    Saith WSG: Nothing is more annoying than to feel that you’re not equal to the intellectual pressure of the conversation.

  15. Pamela R says:

    Oops, a PS for an earlier omitted comment: Aunt Soozie, I had no problem with anything that you said here or in the clustr thread yesterday. You were very understanding, willing to consider the possibility, and trying your best to chill out the animosity there. That was much appreciated!

  16. Wahini61 says:

    Pamela R & Tera,
    I don’t believe there is a clique on this reply page. There are regulars who visit the site, and comment, but a clique? I hardly think so. Folks do stray off the topic, and those posts I sometimes ignore. So the regulars chat to each other, so what? This blog feels like a community, supporting a extremely talented artist, whom they admire. Rock on Alison and Aunt Soozie

  17. HH says:

    Hi all, I am a regular blog reader and a non-commenter. The conversations on this reply page are not what I am on the site for, and for me it would have worked to move the general discussion to a message board.

    There doesn’t seem to be any way to make everybody happy. I wonder if the only possibility would be to completely duplicate the whole blog and have an ‘Alpha blog’ for those who want to engage with a community of Bechdel fans, and a ‘Beta blog’ for those of us who are just here to keep up with what Alison is doing and who would comment only to her/about her stuff.

    I’m not seriously suggesting that as an option, just to point out that whatever form this takes it will be attractive to some and not to others.

  18. meg says:

    Aunt Soozie –

    Yup, just for that – to give her an escape route from all the recent insanity in this niche of the cyberworld. Mud season in Vermont is not just a quaint phrase, y’know.

    However, it is still snowing, and I think I’ve had enough. Make it stop? please?

  19. Susana says:

    I like the idea of an open thread for comments and discussions between DTWOF
    readers. I want Allison to feel no pressure from us about how to run her blog. I read the blog to see what AB is doing and creating and doing. So if we want to share by posting our comments, fine – but that should always be secondary to her being creative for our pleasure. I think she offers us more than enough by giving us a glimpse into what it means to be an artist.

  20. liza says:

    Susana – few artists are creative for someone else’s plesure. We are creative because we have something to say, express, release, communicate. We do it for our own pleasure, needs, drives. If we find an audience, it’s a step in the right direction. If we make money at it – terrific. Some of us work hard to make a living at it. In this day and age a website is imperitive to that end. Yes it’s a great way to be creative and expressive and lots of fun to produce (well, for me anyway) But please, remember that we do it partially to market our names and products.

    But, if you enjoy reading about artists and their process, hop on over to my (non blog )site http://www.lizacowan.com.

    And if you enjoy reading about art and artists, or want to support Alison (and me) hop on over to http://www.pinestreetartworks.com (aka psaw) where you can buy Alison’s original drawings for strips and Fun Home.

    I’m sure that many other readers and posters here have equally intersting and engaging websites. There are some HIGHLY regarded poets, writers, artists, activists and intellectuals who populate this site. I urge everyone not to discount them.

  21. reed_maker says:

    Don’t know if anyone is reading this, and I didn’t read Cyan’s post about the blog (can’t find it amongst all the mess and discussion and quarrel), but I just started posting here, sparingly, a few months ago, and I never felt unwelcome. For me, it’s more that the flood of comments is overwhelming, and I can’t keep up with it (busy life, etc.). Even the threads directly attached to a strip go off-topic pretty quickly, and then I feel, unless I read absolutely all of the 103 comments, I can’t post without sounding out-of-touch. Also, people here are intimidatingly intelligent–but I guess I’m here, too. Huh.

  22. Silvio Soprani says:

    reed_maker, just so you know, there is nothing intimidating about MY intellect, but I stick around here in hopes of stimulating it a bit.

    Tera, and other new post-ers, I just want to say, as someone who is fairly new to blogs (about a year), that it may seem hard to get a word in edgewise, but ignore that feeling and just say what you want to. Sometimes people will respond to you (on this blog, frequently!) or sometimes, you may feel that nobody heard you the first time. But eventually you will become part of the context.

    A friend pointed out to me (I am one of a mere two siblings) that children from large families are better at holding their own in a free-for-all conversation, whereas someone not used to that mob feels cowed and ignored when everyone is butting in all the time. I am that way. But it only takes one or two responses by others to one’s post to feel like one of the family.

    I honestly do not know if we have cliques here; if we do, I would say that everyone is welcome to join them, which i suppose would constitute an oxymoron, right? (I summon the greater linguistic minds than my own to address that one.. And address it they will!)

    So welcome to more voices in the conversation. I am glad no fences will be put up around our willy-nilly melange of topics.

    My last word–to all my Northern North American brothers and sisters, I am so sorry it is snowing where you are.. Here in Baltimore, it is merely cloudy and chilly, presenting only the merest of challenges to devoted, games-starved baseball enthusiasts (of which I am one.)

  23. anon-eponymous says:

    I certainly have felt like a member of the out-group since about the first time I posted on the blog.

    What I realized from interacting with this blog is that it’s a lot like life. Human nature being what it is, any well established social group will have a bunch of dominators and a bunch of outsiders, who don’t really fit in well with the dominators. I’m different, and from long habit I don’t work hard to belong, so I always end up as an outsider.

    It seem likely that any bunch of people who are drawn together in such a passive way, through appreciation of some external thing, rather than through the requirement for cooperation in order to attain a shared goal, are going to fall rapidly prey to this kind of social evolution.

    This is the first time I’ve participated in a blog. At first, when I found out it was like every other social group I’ve ever been involved with, I was upset. Now, I wonder why I was surprised.

    I don’t let it bother me anymore. I can use the same strategy I use with other such groups which have matured to this point, which is to glide blithely by and not let it affect me.

    Perhaps there is no technical solution to human nature, though so many opportunities for technological exploitation of human nature.

    I think any hostility toward AB for a very minor experimental change in format is absolutely unwarranted and bizarre.

  24. Liza from pine street art works says:

    Re: “intimidatingly intellegent”

    While I, who have had to become accustomed to the negotiations of retail exchange, live in awe of good cashiers at the supermarket.

    (arrow to) the little caption on top of my one idea post.

  25. louise says:

    Anon-eponymous:
    You are so emo! 🙂 It is cute.
    I think probably there are more people reading that are like you than unlike you.
    Here is a secret. Most of the time when I post, nobody actually responds to me. I feel like I’m talking to myself. At first I felt neurotic about it. I would recheck the blog like sixty times in a half hour to see if anyone responded to me yet. Then I was like, they are mean and must not like me. You get over it though, you realize that people are mostly concerned with saying their own piece. It’s like a wall of graffiti, sometimes you just feel like you want to say something. And when you engage somebody in conversation it’s great.
    I’m telling everybody, the clique is a total illusion!!! nobody is excluding anybody. You have to just jump in. There are a million people who like Alison’s work and love to chatter about it and make random connections in conversation and I swear up and down attempting to organize it will be a frivolous and pointless endeavor. If you’re bored with what’s being said, say something else! Start a conversation about her work itself! Set your own social standards, subvert the dominant paradigm.

  26. Raffi says:

    I used to post about the strip but ‘the regulars’ pretty much take over everything and talk about everything unrelated. Keep the posts on topic!

  27. notpeanut says:

    Nooooo, Aunt Soozie, don’t hold back! I love reading your posts.

    I am one of the newish lurker types, but I so enjoy reading this blog. It’s always so interesting, even– especially– when there’s a conflict. I wish there were more people around me in my daily life like the folks who post here. I appreciate Maggie’s comments about the importance of this blog… though I actually get out more than I like to, I have found reading this blog very very helpful when I am otherwise losing faith in the goodness of life. I am sad for Alison, though, because I read her taking everyone’s comments to heart, and it just seems like it must be very painful. So I hope she can also remember that she is not responsible for other people’s feelings. I always find that a tricky line to walk myself…

    So anyway, y’all seem pretty wise… who/what have you learned from, to deal with difficult situations in your life, when you are upset about things that are going on? Pema Chodron & Marshall Rosenberg have been major help for me.

  28. van says:

    Having gone through a truckload of highly reactionary posts to see what the hullabaloo’s all about, I just have to say the reaction was close to insane. It was a test, chill. The flinging of words like end of relationships commercial enterprise, donations… ick. Tacky. And over dramatic. You say you don’t mean to imply what it implies, but you said it anyway. Yeah, yeah, without a vibrant community this blog is dead, blah blah… but to make the owner of a blog apologetic for TESTING out something on her OWN space? Appalling.

    And no, we don’t have rights as guests of this blog. Geez, people, get a grip. Who demands rights on a blog?? Request, people. Not demand.

    You say you like AB’s art, stay focused on the reason why you love checking out this blog.

    Alison, the kilometric comments on your strip entries are neither intimidating nor clique-y. If not for their length and occasional personal tangents, the analysis stuff is actually very interesting and adds spice to each strip.

    Do what you want with the blog format, you’ll have whiners regardless of whatever you decide on.

  29. Jana C.H. says:

    I don’t understand why people who don’t like the tangential conversations can’t just ignore them. Yeah, it’s a bit of a hassle to have to page through and skim each letter for key words such as “Mo” or “Sydney” or “Fun Home”. I don’t like lots of paging-through myself; too much mouse-work makes my fingers hurt.

    But the world is not designed for the ultimate convenience of me. I say this to the people who fuss about having to skip through too many comments AND to those freak out at the thought of being relegated to a Kitchen Sink thread. Change what you can, but if your preferred change doesn’t happen, adapt. It’s not really a big deal.

    Jana C.H.
    Seattle
    Saith Will Cuppy: I forget exactly why Rome fell. It was probably just one of those things.

  30. Silvio Soprani says:

    Actually, I think Alison has moved ahead and re-focused the conversation already. (See the newest thread, “Women & Children First.” ) We are reminded that women’s bookstores are bravely battling economic danger.

  31. reed_maker says:

    anon-eponymous:

    “It seems likely that any bunch of people who are drawn together in such a passive way, through appreciation of some external thing, rather than through the requirement for cooperation in order to attain a shared goal, are going to fall rapidly prey to this kind of social evolution.”

    Whoosh–well said!!

    Louise: Ever since you responded to my comment about the weather back in February, I always make a point of looking for your comments, just because we said “hey” to each other once and your comments are always thoughtful. But we are sure not a clique!

  32. Feminista says:

    Silvio–You’re absolutely right,we need to matronize women’s bookstores; they’re an endangered species. My next bookstore run will be to In Other Words,Portland’s women’s bookstore and resource center.

  33. --MC says:

    These conversations tend to bulk up after a day or so, esp. if we get on a lively topic. But so be it thus to most web forums I look at — see, for example, something like joshreads.com, which can rack up as many as three hundred responses every day.
    If nobody responds to my posts, I’m cool with that. Sometimes there’s nothing to say in response.

  34. little gator says:

    grump. no daffodils yet. And I just realised that this is the usual week for dandelions to start here in MA.

    Rain/snow and wind predicetd for the Boston Marathon. Even I’m not that dedicated and will skip it for the 2nd time in 22 years. I’ve been an unoffical water station for most of that time. Plus the BAA moved it all 2 hours earlier, and it’s going to be miserable learning to rearrange my own time.

    At least there won’t be many dehydrated runners with heat stroke who could use my help.

  35. judybusy says:

    anon-eponymous, I certainly want to echo what louise said! (and louise, I am glad I’m not the only one compulsively checking to see if anyone responded to what I said–) a-e, just so you know I *have* paid attention to your posts and enjoyed them. In fact, I really can’t think of a single poster at whom I’ve cringed and thought, “Ugh, not ANOTHER comment by xyz!” I really like it when the quiet ones speak up. I am an appalling motor mouth in real life, and have learned (as my dear wyfe taught me) that “you need to watch the quiet ones. They sit back, taking it all in, and then make these great observations!”

    little gator, hasn’t this spring been atrocious? Those poor runners! We had snow here in Minnesota on Tuesday and Wednesday. On top of that, I think a bunch of bulbs I planted last fall are duds. My sorrel has been shriveled to bits and I am afraid to look at my forsythia, which was all set to bloom ten days ago. Then winter came back. Crabby, crabby, crabby! But now spring is back, my indoor seedlings are looking good, and the bike shop called to say Midge, my bike, is ready to be picked up. Was I *really* homicidal just 48 hours ago?

  36. angela says:

    I read this blog 5-6 times a week. I read it because I’m curious about what one artist is doing/thinking about. I dont know and dont care much about the rest of you. But I’ve been reading DTWOF going on twenty years! And turn all the baby dykes I can find on to Alison and her work. Alison, you are one and we are many. Dont even try to keep up. That is the path to maddness.

  37. little gator says:

    Judybusy-better get snow tires on Midge just in case.

    I don’t haver a bike, but my car is Zorak, after the adorably evil humanoid mantis on Space Ghost. Both Zoraks have green exoskeletons.

    My favorite of all the cars I’ve named is the one we purchased on the night of the solstice. I named that one Bottom, cause it was Midsummer Night when we bought ‘im.

    “it’s not easy being evil, but evil’s what I be.”
    —Zorak

  38. boltgirl says:

    Ah, I like the freeform format. I’m a complete doofus, but I post occasionally anyway. At least I spell reasonably well, although the brain-fingers connection misfires at times. If someone responds, great; if not, hey, I like talking to myself too. And I like the cake recipes.

    When you’re in Tucson, pay a visit to Antigone Books. Women-owned, fantastic staff recommendations, excellent literature section, excellent kids’ section, excellent LGBT, excellent vegetarian cooking, politics, and Southwestern authors… excellent everything.

  39. Silvio Soprani says:

    Hello again, Boltgirl!
    Yes, Antigone Books in Tucson is a wonderland. When I was living in the Tucson area in 2003, Antigone was my oasis. (And then a nice cold glass of beer just down the street! Is it 4th Street? 6th? can’t remember)

    I bought a bumper sticker at Antigone that says “My other car is a Nimbus 2000.” I bought it for the Harry Potter reference, thinking, how diverse of a women’s bookstore to stock Harry stuff….then a WEEK later (I can be so thick sometimes) I connected that it was a take off on the Wiccan reference (“My other car is a broomstick.”)

    I also responded to a bulletin board notice I saw at Antigone for a person seeking a housemate and met an unforgettable woman who raised wolf pups south of Tucson in a rather “suburban” retirement subdivision. The wolves escaped and ate a neighbor’s chickens. My emotions upon hearing this story were complicated. I did not move in with the woman. But I must say that here in Baltimore I never hear those kinds of stories.

    and Boltgirl, I am still regularly enjoying your “Boltgirl on the Loose” blog.

  40. shadocat says:

    ‘lil gator–if you named your car Zorak, maybe I should name my car Brak…

    And Louise (with a capital L) i remember our little “fracas”-and I learned a lot from you too!

  41. X-Cell Ant says:

    anon-eponymous wrote:
    I think any hostility toward AB for a very minor experimental change in format is absolutely unwarranted and bizarre.

    You should excuse the expression, but “amen”

  42. shadocat says:

    i don’t think anyone was hostile at Alison herself—just because I’m a fan, and love someone’s work, doesn’t mean I have like everything they do.

  43. anonymous says:

    of course liking some of the things a person does, and not liking other things is not an expression of hostility. Expressing that dislike of a change by saying,(and this is only one example) “I fucking hate it” might also not be *intended* as an expression of hostility – but it is quite a harsh way to express your dislike, I was definitely infering
    hostility – and while it might not be intended to intimidate the people who disagree with you – you can bet there are plenty of people who would rather not participate here than deal with that.

    So – you can say good riddance to them – but that does make Alison’s original point.

  44. Deena in OR says:

    An observation-
    While Alison may see her attempt at a open thread to have been a “failed experiment”, I think it actually may have succeded in its intent. I *have* noticed a marked decrease in the amount of “lovely discursiveness” since the attempt was made to do the open thread. I’ve also noticed within myself a reluctance to post in general, since I will be the first to admit that I tend to digress at times, and I don’t always self-edit well. But I do, when I post, now pause first to ask my self “Is this wanted here now?” If inhibition of off topic postings was intended, I think it has been a success.

    My attempt at providing another venue for the off-topic stuff has not worked out so well…mostly, I think, because of the limitations of MySpace. I may retry the attempt in a blog specific venue…I don’t know yet.

  45. X-Cell Ant says:

    I want to echo what “anonymous” writes just above.

    And if I may speak frankly to shadocat: I’m perfectly willing (and glad to)accept that it was not your intent to respond in a “hostile” way. However, I think it is also fair to suggest that it might not be out of line for a reasonable reader to read what you wrote and perceive it as hostile or as an overreaction. (“Anonymous” gives an example above; as s/he suggests there, are others.)

    Everyone, of course, is entitled to their opinions, however
    strongly held. But expressing strong emotion –and making it end up sounding as you intended for it to sound– is a difficult art. And something very (very) few of us are capable of managing. Again, hostility, in any sense, may not have been the intent. But, to a disinterested reader on the sideline, there sure seems to be a lot of –wholly unwarrented– hostility flying around here lately.

  46. Marj says:

    Somewhere up there I read I don’t have to read all the posts before making one of my own (hurrah – that’s what usually stops me) so apologies if someone’s already said something along these lines, but is anyone familiar with Criag’s List? I sometimes read the w4w (blog? chatroom? thread? I don’t know what it is, really – insufficient technical knowledge). That format seems ideal – everything is in the same place, but you don’t have to read each person’s whole input, just the first line; plus you can add your comment wherever it’s relevant.

    For the record, I love AB, and I love all you regulars too – as an habitual lurker, I don’t feel excluded at all, more like a shy person at a party of generous souls – but in the end it is AB’s baby, so it is up to her to do with it what she will. It is incredibly generous of her to give so much of herself. (Alison – if you have managed to hang in this far – thank you!)

  47. rin says:

    “Until I start paying for the website, Allison B. owes me or you nothing. As far as I’m concerned, she can organize the site any way she wants – she’s paying for it. (And these puppies do cost some hard bucks to maintain.)”

    here here!!

  48. Jen says:

    Well, you have to admit it does seem to work–the two latest posts seem to have a much more managable return numbers wise

  49. Pam I says:

    Jen, if numbers of posts have dropped it’s likely to be that “retired, hurt” is where some regular posters are right now.

  50. JK says:

    I’ve posted a couple times too and haven’t seen people respond to them. Makes me feel a little better that others have had this experience and have felt funky about it. BUT I really like a lot of the “regulars'” postings – I read ’em all when I feel like it, I don’t when I don’t, and on occasion I use FireFox’s “find” function to hone in on a particular topic. That said, if newcomers came and were more interested in discussing Alison’s work and less interested in lots of vibrant far-reaching queer-positive community… then…

  51. anonymous says:

    It seems like the multiple sides of this conversation have been pretty well stated. I do want to add that I agree with the assessment of Van and a few other posters on here – whatever the reactions that folks had to Alison’s suggestion, the hostile and injured tone taking by many in their responses seemed completely inappropriate. Like Van I find it completely ridiculous that Alison ended up apologizing for making a simple suggestion that merely sought to reorganize her OWN page, and did not devalue anyone. I hope she will receive some apologies from posters…

  52. artgirlxx says:

    I have never posted here, but feel compelled to now. I love these “conversations”. I was telling a friend of mine last night about this site and the lively wonderful community that it has fostered. I have not perceived this group or their comments as clique-ish, but rather (although I have not posted), by the nature of their concerns they have made me feel like I am part of a larger women’s community. The reason I have not posted has more to do with my wallflower nature, not the flavor of the group. Alison rocks!

  53. mlk says:

    A-E wrote (eons ago . . . way back on 4/13) “Perhaps there is no technical solution to human nature, though so many opportunities for technological exploitation of human nature.”

    I wonder sometimes why we expect technology to somehow change human nature. sometimes it seems rather to amplify it — like the rudeness of folks who answer cell phones at inopportune times instead of turning them off or silencing them.

    Louise’s comment immediately after about her experience as a poster is (almost) identical to my own.

    and now I’m going to go back and read what others have posted. whether it’s a good idea or not, I’m responding to what resonated with me. a rather daring move, but this seems to be a safe place to take risks . . .

    my thanks to all who’ve made it so.

  54. Anonymous says:

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  55. Abapopaxy says:

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